Cat-Calling or "Eve-Teasing" in India

 
I thought after the Nirbhaya rape, things had improved. Even my mom said when she visited India in 2014, that she felt things were improving and there was no cat-calling. Guess not.....

 

Shaadi.com Experiment Update

SHAADI.COM EXPERIMENT
BY R. SHUKLA

INTRODUCTION AND WHY I AM DOING THIS EXPERIMENT
................................................................................................................

Purpose:        I am really curious about the Indian male mentality and how egalitarian it has actually become, especially with educated* (supposedly "enlightened")  men who have access to the Internet.  The purpose of this experiment is to figure out if guys really want what they say they want. In the 21st century, most women are independent and working and have confidence in themselves.  Many men, even Indian/NRI men say they want an independent and equal partner, but do they really? Let's see how many men actually want an equal.....and how many are just paying lip service. In Payal's profile, we see she has no other interests besides wanting to be a stay at home wife. Basically, she wants to live for her man. She doesn't seem interested in intellectual pursuits like politics and current events. She is sexy, but not sexual (not even kissed a boy!) She is pure and still a virgin.  Actually most of Payal's profile information comes from this blog where there is a poem like this: 

" Karyeshu Dasi, Karaneshu Manthri,
  Bhojeshu Mata, Shayaneshu Rambha,
  Roopeshu Lakshmi, Kshamayeshu Dharitri,
  Satkarma Nari, Kuladharma Patni "


 Line for line, it means : 
"Works hard (as a slave) , Gives smart advice (like a minister),
Feeds and cares (like a mother) , Is a sex-goddess in bed (like the apsara Rambha) ,
Is beautiful (like goddess lakshmi), Is forgiving (like mother earth),
These are the ideal qualities (and duties) of a wife "

......................................................................................

Comments from the OP

"So, to be an ideal indian wife, all i have to do, is be a mom in the kitchen, a slut in the bedroom, a maid in the living room, all while looking like a bombshell, and not to mention, forgive any of his 'little' slipups, like ohhh, I don't know...forgetting our anniversary !!! or leaving his underwear on the bathroom floor !!! (which he really has done today...yikesss), ok....thanks, got it, check...Now that I know all this, what's stopping me from being an ideal wife.....ohh, I know, my BRAIN !!! I mean , come on here, I don't know whether to be mad or amused, it's ridiculous to the point of hilarity ." 

"Also, please note that there is no such verse for the ideal husband, because logically, the guy could be any schmuck out there, but since he's married to the ideal wife, he isn't required to be any more than a schmuck." 
------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I fully agree with the author of the original blog post that I got the poem from. It is so ridiculous it is hilarious. No woman- no HUMAN would be like this. Essentially, she doesn't have a personality. She is a living blow up doll.  Her lifelong dream is to get married. You would think that men would know there are no women like this, because *newsflash* women are breathing, living creatures with ideas, personalities and thoughts of their own. Yet it is sad that men think women like this exist, and moreover, they prefer a woman like this. 

...................................................................................................

 I'll include an obligatory profile picture: (not of me obviously)




HYPOTHESIS: I'd like to think that most people would be able to say that this is a fake post, but sadly most people will think that a person like this actually exists in our patriarchal society.

*Drumroll* Ladies and Gentlement, meet.........

Payal Rohand


"BIODATA": 

 View Full Photo

• Age / Height
  24 / 5' 8"
• Marital Status
  Never Married
• Posted by
  Self

• Religion / Community
  Hindu, Brahmin
• Location
  Rhinelander
• Mother Tongue
  Gujarati
• 
  

I am a model. Grew up in the US, loves fashion and beauty. Independent and modern but simple homely indian girl on inside. I also believe in husband as head of household (or pati parmeshvar hai) and I am pro-men, anti-feminist. I am a party girl now but willing to quit, and also quit eating non veg and drinking. I am a virgin, never even kissed a boy so I am innocent. Also I am religious and do fastings. Prefer to stay at in law's home and be housewife after marriage.I know how to cook well. Looking for indian gentlemen who knows how to treat a lady and is also dominant and strong enough to be the leader in relationship and so I have respect for him. Need to have "aankhon ki sharam" for him. I will work hard to be a good wife and will keep looking beautiful. I will treat you as a treasure. I will also support and advise you in troubles and am very patient and forgiving. Looks/Height/Caste no bar...tell me why you think you are good for me.


RESULTS: 

I have 596 invitations (currently) and over 250,000 potential matches. It is safe to say I am in demand. Most of them were easy to decline because they sent an automated response. I only wanted the ones that bothered to send a personal message, but only a few sent a personal message Also I got 9 requests for phone numbers and 2 given to me. When I was on there, about 30 people messaged me on chat.  In some profiles, the parents said they were interested in me for their son, I found it funny that the son couldn't do it himself. You would think that only people in India would think like this, but there were some NRI's who still did this. Actually, most of the guys who were in India made their profiles by themselves while more NRI's did the parent/relative/brother thing. 

Maybe the reason is that NRI guys are not really looking for marriage in their 20's, while in India since it is a sexually repressed society, these guys jump on the marriage train as soon as they come of age, whether they are mature for it or not, because marriage is the only way for socially approved sex. Also, the Bollywood movies play a huge part in what the Indian guys think *romance* is like and what women want. 

Another interesting thing was that even though I said Looks/Caste/Height no bar, I was very specific about religion. Still, I got invitations from Christian, Jain, Sikh and other nationalities also. Maybe they thought that I would gladly agree to convert. 

Now let's get to the good part: 
(My comments are in regular font and theirs are bolded and italicized.)
...............................................................................................................

Hello, We have liked your profile and believe it to be good Match. If you like our son's profile, kindly accept this Invitation. We can then pursue this further on ph: Phone Number Visible on Accept or through email:Email Id Visible on Accept Warm Regards,_______




One family made it a bonding activity...
Hi, I and my son have liked your profile and believe it to be good Match. 




 Here are the personal email responses (out of the 596 currently): 


One man in his profile just cut to the basics and stated his salary, it really justified my hypothesis that marriage in India is a "business transaction" and that is what guys think girls want (exchange beauty/domesticity for wealth). 
Hi, I am__________ from ahmedabad.I am in accounting field earning 12000.00/per month & have rental income of 7000.00 to 8000.00.we have two members in my family. My mother & me.My father passed away & i have a one sister who is married.I have a simple attitude no bad habits like drinking & smoking. I am big fan of shahrukh khan & love to wear different types of aviators. i likes cricket & music. I trying to find a loyal & honest life partner. Friendship is important in longlife relationship, so my better half will be my best friend whom in can interact easily as well as share my thoughts without hasitating.




One guy complimented me on my "Indian Values" and said finding a girl like me was rare...I don't see how that's a good thing. 


Hi, My name is A I I really liked your profile. I love how you have retained your values so well, which is rare to find even in girls from India. I am also a understanding, caring and supportive person. I also love my indian culture and respect my heritage. I do not have any extraordinary expectations from my ideal partner. I like simplicity. I may not be a model, but I am very honest and will give it my all to keep my partner happy. Well if you are interested in my profile then we can chat further. A.




He thinks I have *beautiful thoughts* code for...I like that you're a doormat. Also felt the need to put USA in parenthesis (LOOK I'M FROM THE US!)
Hi Payal. Enjoyed reading what you wrote. More than a beautiful face I see beautiful thoughts. Would like to get to know you better. Hope to hear back from you. R.(USA)






Only one thing to say...........wow....cheesy or what?
Hi, i liked your profile description. You look like my dream wife. (So pretty much sums up what Indian guys in India at least, want in a wife). I am good for you because i can promise you that you close your eyes and start your journey of life with me and you will never ever open your eyes .you will live in your dreams. N


This guy actually took the time to read the profile...
you really think you can live in india? your profile kinda sparked my curiosity so to speak.hope to hear from you


This guy really fell in love with the provider/dominant man fantasy...The last sentence is just LOL.
Coz -i will be the provider for the family -Honest guy like an open book.there is no other side in me -Going to take care of you -Started to work out recently.so may take some time :)




One guy unabashedly put a picture of him with a doctor's coat and stethoscope.  He might as well have said he's looking for gold diggers. 


Now this next guy was weird. First sentence was that he is an engineer. Didn't mention anything about himself but gave his whole family tree....I guess he wanted to prove that he was not "backwards" because he had connections in Pardes? 
hi miss, i am an engineer in india and my brother lives in new york and is married and works for national brock lab of new york as an engineer and my sister is a nurse and lives in new york as well and is married and rest of family lives in calgary canada. one of my sister lives in calgary and owns her house and is unmarried and other one is married and lives in edmonton  and my mama g (LOL Mama G) is a very reputed property consultant and lives in calgary. 




One guy just jumped into asking what my fav movie was..
hi, how are you?I'm A.So what's your favorite movie?




This guy understood that friendship comes before romance...
 My name is R frm India. I like your profile , First , I would like to friendship (the cliche fraandship LOL) with you


Why would you not read someone's profile? It's there for a reason. 
You seem like a nice person , I would love to get to know you . I like to figure people out gradually rather than reading profiles and see where it goes.let me know if you really want to go ahead.




Cheese......so much cheese (This guy is in the US but you can tell he's from India because no guy raised here talks like this...)
Hi, How you doing ? I saw your profile and thought of saying Hi. hoping the Hi will lead to a wonderful conversation :) If you feel the same, Lets Connect.! 




This was kind of nice...(again, from US but you can tell the difference he's been raised here, compared to the previous guy.It's more likely the previous guy came here for a working or study visa. 
Hey! You sound like an awesome person. I'd love the opportunity to get to know you :)




This one was like, "Yeah, so I just want to tell you *casually* that I'm in med school..nothing about interests or anything else". It says a lot about what Indian guys (even NRI guys--you would assume this guy is more egalitarian)  think potential Indian girls are interested in. 
Hi How are you? So my name is ______said like an american haha. I was born in London but my family moved to the US when I was 11. I am about to finish med school in Philadelphia and might be moving for a emergency med residency. Let me know if you wanted to connect :) If not good luck! 

hey, first I want to know whr u wanna stay after marriage ?India or USA? I am looking for understanding, loving, who respects my parents and treats them as her own parents after marriage and stands by me in every situation of life. we belong to middle class family but having bright future so economically no need to worry in my home. and I like whatever u wrote frankly in Ur profile and I m impressed by it. if u reject my profile then also no issue , but at least I request u to tell me the reason. thanks ______(The only thing I have to say about this is see IHM's post on this: 
https://indianhomemaker.wordpress.com/2012/04/23/an-email-my-principal-fear-is-my-wife-is-not-going-to-be-able-to-love-my-parents-as-much-as-i-do/  )
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Only a few got the idea...(or knew that a girl like this cannot exist). 
this is a joke. right? I don't know anyone who would say 'pro-men' lol you're nuts if you really are looking for what you say you are


Haha.is this a joke ;)




Hey!! Your profile looks so unreal haha Seems too true man Haha but none the less we can talk and see where it goes?


And this guy was really sweet..but maybe it was part of his plan since he knew other guys wouldn't act like this and he wanted to be the special snowflake who actually *cared*.  Didn't even want to connect, just wanted to give me advice so that counts for something. But maybe on the other hand he thinks he can spark a conversation.  
Why is your profile like this. You're intelligent and smart. (How is Payal smart and intelligent if she only finished high school? Something is fishy.) Forget about all that. Don't give up on your dreams to become the housewife types for the purpose of appealing to the society or the home. Be yourself and love what you do and find someone who can respect you for that.

Charts

















CONCLUSION:
The conclusions of this study are that although India touts gender equality through its "Westernized" movies and media in an effort to become more modern, the majority of men in India only do lip service to this idea. In fact, most educated men (educated meaning speaking good English and having access to a computer) want and appreciate a woman like Payal, who is molded on the regressive gender ideals of centuries past. The implications of this study are that there is still a lot of work to be done in terms of gender equality. Considering that arranged marriages are the single most popular way young Indians get married, it is important that gender equality progresses in the Indian marriage market. Also, we need to get Indian men to WANT to have equal wives and not be so impressionable by mostly misogynistic Indian movies that now feature the paradox of women being modern and stylish on the outside but still having "traditional" values. Or, the fact that she should be "cool" and not homely on the outside, but have homely values on the inside.
 
I also did an experiment with a darker woman named "Laila Rohan" who was the antithesis of Payal- a feminist who wanted an equal partner and said up front that she would not be the more passive partner. Surprisingly, Laila also had suitors, although not as many as Payal. I think that all woman, as long as they have a vagina, will get suitors on this website. I found that Laila's suitors were also more attractive, although that is just my subjective opinion. This might be because the parents of those suitors found each other physically attractive and were in more of a love marriage, while people who were less attractive were found partners through the rigid arranged marriage, which is more orthodox. So the children of the orthodox parents grew up wanting a woman like Payal whereas the more liberal (attractive) children find Laila more attractive. At least that is my theory. What I found interesting was that a lot of parents were interested in Laila for their son, while more "self" created profiles were interested in Payal. This was interesting to me as you would think a potential Indian MIL would want a submissive DIL. But maybe secretly they wanted a strong and capable partner for their son. Any thoughts to why this is? 
 
I was saddened by these results, I guess I used to think that only people of older generations like my parents and grandparents thought this way but it is scary to see that the current generation is like this too. I will post a more "polished" analysis as I think of it. But what are YOUR thoughts on this?

Skin Color In India

I came across this while working on my mega Shaadi.com Experiment that I told you about a few posts back. I found this and thought I would share. This is funny, but also shows how much the "fairer" skin color is valued, even in males. Maybe he was actually telling the truth and it was just the lighting that caused him to look like that (sarcasm).

 But really, did this guy think he could fool anyone? 

Satyamev Jayate and "Mardangini"

It is important that issues of masculinity are talked about in India.
And one important platform (if not the only) for that is the new TV show Satyamev Jayate (new in the sense that I just found out about it).

Usually in India, the culture is so deeply ingrained in its normal routine, that it does not even realize it is steeped in patriarchy. One exemplary analogy for this is a fish that does not realize it is surrounded by water, because it has never seen a complement. I think a show like Satyamev Jayate was desperately needed to make Indians aware of this "water" that they are swimming in, if you will. I think that Indians in India do have a sense that in other countries, women are treated more equally, or are more "westernized", but unfortunately that is seen as a direct threat to Indian "tradition" and "culture". I know from personal experience, that especially older Indians, get defensive about this topic and puff out their chest in pseudo-nationalistic pride. I say pseudo because if they were really nationalistic, they would be open to constructive change on how to make their country better. But what they are doing instead is just trying to keep a old system alive for fear of change, which is not related to its citizens' benefit at all.

Arguably though, there is still a lot of change that needs to be done. It reminds me of something The Indian Male Feminist said on the controversial Youtube video "Will you Marry a Raped Girl?" Ignoring the crass title, the fact that they found some "heroes" who were willing to. Bullshit. You don't get brownie points for that, just as you don't get brownie points for not raping someone when you have the opportunity to get away with it. That is just the baseline for being a decent human being. You don't get a reward for meeting the minimum. Which makes the people of the opposite opinion even more sad, because they don't even meet that baseline. It is true that the majority of people think this way, though that is no excuse for rewarding the ones that don't. You can't stoop to such low expectations, because then India will be fucked. How messed up is it that we would be grateful for such kindness (*sarcasm intended*). The truth is, there will always be people that go above and beyond without any praise or incentives, simply because they are capable of understanding empathy, and capable of thinking that just because they are nice also doesn't mean they are doing a great "sacrifice" and it also doesn't mean that the bestowed is to be pitied or victimized.

The same thing is seen in Satyamev Jayate, where at the end of the "Mardangini" episode, they have examples of men who have changed. A few examples are of men who admitted that they used to beat their wives and then they finally realized that it was WRONG and EVIL and now they don't anymore and then the audience claps and gives them an ovation while the men look proud at their achievement. Again, bullshit.If you need to have an epiphany that beating others is wrong, there is seriously something wrong with you and ideally, you need to go back in the womb again and start life all over again. After all, women have known this all along and they don't get recognized for not hurting anyone.

But maybe I'm wrong. Maybe they *do* deserve this praise, after realizing this life lesson in a profoundly patriarchal society. I guess my standard for humanity is so high that I just cannot relate or sympathize at all. I don't know. Tell me what you think? Is this an achievement or not or simply part of being a decent person?

Shaadi.com Experiment

I am really curious about the Indian male mentality and how egalitarian it has actually become, especially with educated men who have access to the Internet. There is a poem about the Ideal Indian Woman, and I have built a profile based around it.
" Karyeshu Dasi, Karaneshu Manthri,
  Bhojeshu Mata, Shayaneshu Rambha,
  Roopeshu Lakshmi, Kshamayeshu Dharitri,
  Satkarma Nari, Kuladharma Patni "


 Line for line, it means : 
"Works hard (as a slave) , Gives smart advice (like a minister),
Feeds and cares (like a mother) , Is a sex-goddess in bed (like the apsara Rambha) ,
Is beautiful (like goddess lakshmi), Is forgiving (like mother earth),
These are the ideal qualities (and duties) of a wife "

Here is my profile:

I am a model. Grew up in the US, loves fashion and beauty. Independent and modern but simple homely indian girl on inside. I also believe in husband as head of household (or pati parmeshvar hai) and I am pro-men, anti-feminist. I am a party girl now but willing to quit, and also quit eating non veg and drinking. I am a virgin, never even kissed a boy so I am innocent. Also I am religious and do fastings. Prefer to stay at in law's home and be housewife after marriage.I know how to cook well. Looking for indian gentlemen who knows how to treat a lady and is also dominant and strong enough to be the leader in relationship and so I have respect for him. Need to have "aankhon ki sharam" for him. I will work hard to be a good wife and will keep looking beautiful. I will also support and advise you in troubles and am very patient and forgiving. Looks/Height/Caste no bar...tell me why you think you are good for me.
 and obligatory profile picture: (not of me obviously)
Let's see how many men actually want an equal.....and how many are just paying lip service.
I'd like to think that most people would be able to say that this is a fake post, but sadly most people
will think that a person like this actually exists in our patriarchal society.

Marriage and Indian Parents part1

Here are some comments that stood out to me from other Indian feminist blogs about marriage and parents.

I don’t think its right to say Indian parents don’t want their children to be happy. It’s just that they think they know best for their children, never mind that their children are fully grown adults with serious careers who have been living by themselves for years now. They genuinely think that the differences – cultural, religious, language, whatever – are big enough to cause problems for the couple. This is because the parents come from that sort of a milieu, where they have been married to someone from another background, and have learnt to adjust and leave – so isn’t that what is going to work best for their children too?
The other problem is that India is still very much a collective culture, in the sense that the happiness of the group is much more important than the happiness of the individual. And it’s at the root of the ‘what will people think’ chant of many Indians, especially many older Indians. So Indian parents want their children to marry somebody who is acceptable to society – someone from the opposite sex, someone who is equally well off, if not more, someone from the same country/state/religion/caste etc.
I hope I’m not out of line when I say this, but in all this discussion around Indian parents, let’s not forget that your man is a fully grown adult who should be making his decisions for himself. I have known enough people who have faced opposition from their parents and managed to deal with it and marry the partner of their choice, either by convincing his parents or going ahead without their blessings. So maybe you are better off without a partner who is unable to make a difficult decision and stand by it.
 I don’t think Indian girls were ever raised to think about or care whether their husband is a virgin or not – only their own virginity is ever discussed and fetished.
http://indianhomemaker.wordpress.com/2014/06/04/you-can-listen-to-your-parents-and-be-unhappy-or-you-can-go-against-them-and-feel-guilty-those-are-your-choices/
http://indianhomemaker.wordpress.com/2011/07/07/an-email-from-an-indian-husband/

Some Indian parents can’t care less how many girls their son “scored” before getting married. What matters is that they, the parents finally “win”. The guy’s ill morals is something that nobody challenges. And I’m talking about living examples, people that I know myself.

-we have a system, which asks us to compromise on many things..
it is highly difficult for a self reliant individual

Parents do not want their children to be happy. They want their children to fit into a mould for their sake, and for the sake of appearances.

It’s blackmail, pure and simple. The threat is the severance of family ties unless the girl/guy gets married to one of their choice. Because of this, I think its perfectly fair to call the blackmailer’s bluff and just go ahead. It’s a choice between making yourself happy versus making someone else happy at your expense – for life.

Yes our parents did a lot for us. Yes they are grateful. But to use that as a bludgeon and threaten excommunication reveals the true intentions behind this “love”. It’s not love. It’s control.

For many Indian parents, (male) children are an investment. They are pushed into nice, traditional life-trajectories, pushed into nice, conventional careers, pushed into marriage with nice, traditional women, and guilted and emotionally blackmailed into behaving like nice little minions of their parents. Forever.

What is important to them is their future security, their control over their children (mostly sons), their ownership over the d-i-l and grandchildren, their standing is society, the amount on money they can make from a son’s marriage, their remaining number one in their son’s life even though he has a wife and kids. The son’s happiness does not matter. Not because they are inherently mean people or that they don’t love their sons. It’s because they feel that they know best. That their adult sons should not think for themselves. It’s like your toddler is crying for candy but you in all your wisdom won’t let him have it because it’s bad for him. You will offer him a carrot stick instead. Because you are the parent and you know best.

ndian society is in transition from being tightly clan-based to one that is more individualistic and many young people are caught in the middle. In a clan-based society, every member is expected to play a role and the performance of the role is supposed to guarantee the greater good of the clan and hopefully for the individual, though the individual is of less importance. It’s not as simple as a ‘yes or no’ answer to ‘don’t Indian parents want their kids to be happy? These parents believe that their kids will be happy if they stick to the traditional norms because that’s what they (the parents) did and they were happy. And by sticking to the traditional plan, not only will the child (eventually) be happy or at least resigned enough not to complain, but the family and society will be too. So win-win in their minds, if only the child would stop being difficult.

The problem is that young people don’t fit into this clan-based model so well anymore. I believe this transition into greater individualism is inevitable but right now, you’re going to see a lot of these sandwiched people. I personally don’t believe someone who has tasted a loving and genuine relationship with someone of their choice will be fulfilled in an artificially-created one. Though there have been cases where guys have given up the girlfriends of their choosing for an arranged marriage and been happy. The thing is that the traditional Indian marriage set-up offers a lot of perks for guys – being waited on hand and foot by the wife for example – which kind of smooths the path, and of course the idea is that the cultural similarities make adjustments easier. Nowadays it’s possible for guys to find a beautiful wife, who is somewhat modern, holds a good job etc. and still in the end, defers to the husband and runs the home singlehandedly. Makes heartbreak easier to swallow. Though it doesn’t work for all.

I think women face more pressure and have way fewer choices than do men; but many women still stand up for themselves and fight for their choices.

I know very few men who have stood up to their parents or braved social censure.

I know a lot of women who have, so I’m inclined to think that Indian men find it more difficult to swim against the tide of social and parental disapproval.

I do believe, based solely on personal experiences, that women are better at coping with adversity and ambiguity than are men.

I have encountered more courage and conviction in women than I have in men, especially when it comes to family/relationships.